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Beat
Beat
Posts: 165
What is the native Colorspace in FF?
Would that be sRGB?

TheBeat
The Stone Age did not end because they ran out of stones. Niels Bohr
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GMM
Moderator
Filter Forge, Inc
Posts: 3491
Filter Forge doesn't have a native colorspace, it operates on raw pixel values and doesn't perform any explicit colorspace conversion. If you feed an AdobeRGB, a CMYK or any other image into FF it will be processed without any color mapping.

The only exception is gamma correction which is mostly relevant to formats like OpenEXR.
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SpaceRay
SpaceRay

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Quote
GMM wrote:
If you feed an AdobeRGB, a CMYK or any other image into FF it will be processed without any color mapping.


Maybe I am wrong, but from what I have tested I think that if you feed an image that has a different colorspace than sRGB in the standalone version, then Filter Forge will convert all the images that are rendered using the Standalone version to sRGB

What is true and real of what you have said is when the image is processed as a plugin, then is true that Filter Forge will not touch the colorspace and process it without any color mapping

Filter forge will NOT tell that it will convert the result in standalone to sRGB if the source has a different colorspace.

This could be a big problem if you have an image with another color space, and then you apply a FF filter, save the result and give to someone else THINKING that it keeps the same color space as the original source BUT IS WRONG, as FF will convert it to sRGB unless you use FF as a plugin and apply the filter instead of saving it from FF
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Beat
Beat
Posts: 165
Thanks, SpaceRay, that is very valuable info for me, as I mostly use the standalone version.
After getting the answer of GMM, I thought it actually very logical and great that FF leaves the colorspace alone. Which makes sense, as FF "just" crunches numbers and should not be concerned with colorspaces.
My question would be : why is that different in the Stand Alone version?

Beat
The Stone Age did not end because they ran out of stones. Niels Bohr
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SpaceRay
SpaceRay

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Beat wrote:
My question would be : why is that different in the Stand Alone version?


This is a good question and I do not know why it happens only on standalone, but I may have a possible idea

Well,it seems that as a plugin maybe the image is processed from a different way as the host is the one who is processing the image and to the one who will be given the rendered result and you will save the result from the host software and not from Filter Forge, so Filter Forge will NOT save the image itself in any format, it will just give the rendered result to the host software as it was given, and so it will not change the colorspace

According to this I think that maybe Filter forge standalone modifies the colorspace only because it needs to save the image to a given format

FILTER FORGE STANDALONE WILL ALSO CHANGE THE DPI TO 72DPI

The standalone version will not only change the colorspace, it will also change the DPI to 72dpi. So if you use a 300 dpi image for printing the rendered result will be saved as 72 dpi and although you will not loose any quality because you can reassign the number of dpi, you must be aware that you need to change the dpi of filter forge rendered resultsaved from filter forge standalone

The explanation to this I think maybe is the same as above here, in the plugin version is the host that processes and saves the image so. it will keep the 300 dpi when processed

For more information

FF standalone Killing DPI (not really resolution)

PHOTOSHOP IS NOT THE ONLY HOST AVAILABLE AND POSSIBLE IF YOU ARE USING WINDOWS

to use FF as a plugin there are many possible host software that can be used

List of supported software as hosts for using Filter Forge as plugin
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Beat
Beat
Posts: 165
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SpaceRay wrote : According to this I think that maybe Filter forge standalone modifies the colorspace only because it needs to save the image to a given format


I think this is a very valid thought. Maybe in the future FF will provide with a setting to choose your colorspace (it would be handy to have the same working space as f.i. you use in your main editing program.


Quote
SpaceRay wrote :
FILTER FORGE STANDALONE WILL ALSO CHANGE THE DPI TO 72DPI

The standalone version will not only change the colorspace, it will also change the DPI to 72dpi.


I think this is a very good reminder. I had noticed it also, but as it does not change the 'quality' or amount of data (pixels) in the image, it was not one of my burning questions smile:-) But I think it's good for everyone to realize.

I am on Mac OSX and am really very familiar with PS, so I carry the necessary conversion to my working colorspace as a man smile:-)

Thanks SpaceRay,

Beat
The Stone Age did not end because they ran out of stones. Niels Bohr
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SpaceRay
SpaceRay

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Beat wrote:
I think this is a very valid thought. Maybe in the future FF will provide with a setting to choose your colorspace (it would be handy to have the same working space as f.i. you use in your main editing program.


For this you need to use a host software and use FF as a plugin now, and I think that they probably will not add this as they usually add things that are missing or not possible or available in current version, and this is already possible as a plugin

Quote
Beat wrote:
but as it does not change the 'quality' or amount of data (pixels) in the image


Yes, is true that as I said also, and you are right that it does not change the quality or number of pixels, but it is not told that FF will convert the result to a 72 dpi, so you can not know that you need to put back whatever dpi you had before

Quote
Beat wrote:
am on Mac OSX and am really very familiar with PS, so I carry the necessary conversion to my working colorspace as a man


If you already use and have PS software, why you do not like or want to use FF as a plugin ?
As it will solve both problems and will keep the colorspace and keep the dpi and not need to do any conversion
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Beat
Beat
Posts: 165
Quote
SpaceRay wrote : If you already use and have PS software, why you do not like or want to use FF as a plugin ?


Good question? I think it grew that way, firstly because I am still designing a lot of filters and I can only open the editor from the stand alone version. Secondly, FF is mostly at the start of my process, so the Standalone seemed comfortable. In comparison, Topaz plugs, I use inside of PS, not as standalone.

But the whole thing with the sRGB colorspace and the dpi change, is not so bad for me (there are things in FF that in my opinion, that would need attention first). I just want to understand and know what happens behind my back, so I can anticipate.

I will try to do more with FF in PS smile:-)
The Stone Age did not end because they ran out of stones. Niels Bohr
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