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Kraellin
Kraellin

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ok, rather than keep putting development things in that other thread with the rock and snow stuff, i thought i'd better start a new thread.

here's a pic from a new one i'm working on. the potential here is pretty cool and i'm already liking this. this is basically an offshoot of the snow covered rock filter, but significantly different.

here's a first look:

If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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ahimsa

Posts: 3163
Filters: 41
I made a stream bed from your other filter that I hope to use in that pic. You have an area in the settings where it begins to make the rocks look wet and that was really nice. That's what made me think of using it for a stream. smile:)
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Kraellin
Kraellin

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ah, you'll have to show me that.

so, what about this one? what do you think it needs?
If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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ahimsa

Posts: 3163
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You can see the wet areas here. I added a layer of my water over this and it looked really good. I didn't save that as it was done in FF and doesn't give as good an effect as in Bryce.

As for the one you have there...any chance for some sand and gravel in between the larger rocks? Is that even possible?

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ahimsa

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Here is the water I will be using. I'm working on the scene right now, but the terrain didn't want to cooperate very well in Bryce, so I am trying it in Poser now.



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Kraellin
Kraellin

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i can see a little bit of wet in that first one, but i think that one is one that is going to lend itself to the 'eye of the beholder' a bit more than the others. i see a very light dusting of snow, that maybe is melting and therefore a bit wet.

and i think your second one here looks good. is that water over the snow covered land filter?
If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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Kraellin
Kraellin

Posts: 12749
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oh, and regarding the snow and gravel in mine, yes, i was sort of looking into that also. i could probably do it with some work. the components i'm using dont really lend to that by themselves, though. the 'stones' component is the main component and i could do an alpha extraction and then stick some other textures in the transparent areas, but the filter is already running somewhat slow. but, i'll certainly bear it in mind and see what can be done.

and one thing along with that is, i was toying with the idea of using two stones components, but that might make it crawl so badly even a quad core computer would have a hard time smile:)
If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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Kraellin
Kraellin

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ok, here's a bit of an update. i've put a little surface reflection/ripple on the thing. it's still quite rough, but shows sort of where i'm headed.

no sand or anything else yet.

If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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ahimsa

Posts: 3163
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That's just the water that I want to use over top of the rocks. It will be transparent in Bryce.

Well, the object file for my buck is MIA, so now I need to reinstall that.

The stone components do slow things down smile:)
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ahimsa

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That's pretty neat looking!
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Carl
c r v a

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This is look promising smile:)
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Kraellin
Kraellin

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Quote
That's just the water that I want to use over top of the rocks
. ah, ok. well, i still like it smile:)

object file for your buck? as in stag, male deer? for the scenery pictures? on the snow covered filter, if you're using that, remember, you can use the 'size' slider to scale the entire scene if you need to. i was even thinking of how to import your animals into FF as an imported image. if you did them as a cutout, with all the background erased to a transparency, you could add an image component to the snow covered filter and add in a blend component near the end of the filter and put the image component on the foreground node of the blen and the rest of the filter on the background node and your stag/buch/animal would show over the scenery. that could be kind of cool. it wouldnt be 3d like in bryce or poser, but still kinda cool smile:)

and thanks, ahimsa. thanks, carl smile:) i like this one too. hopefully, i can get it refined more and maybe add some sand and stuff to it.
If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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StevieJ
Designer/Artist

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Nice noise work.....especially like the first sample smile8)
Steve

"Buzzards gotta eat...same as worms..." - Clint :)
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Kraellin
Kraellin

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Filters: 99
ah, good. yeah, the first one is much cleaner at the moment. the surface reflection/ripple is still rough. well, the other is still rough too, but you know what i mean smile:)

the first one was also just to be rocks under the surface level, but the second i was trying to get some of the rocks above surface, with a ripple effect against them, and some below. what i ended up with was more a surface relection, but you can see some of what i was after... if you look close... and use your imagination... and cross your eyes a bit... and...
If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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Kraellin
Kraellin

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so, back to the tweaking process. i've added a number of controls and tried to add some sand, but that one is a bit of a problem yet. it's there, but it looks more like other-colored rocks than sand at the moment. something about adding the 'water' over the top changes the look pretty radically.

and this has to be the most perlins i've ever used in one filter smile;)

If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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Kraellin
Kraellin

Posts: 12749
Filters: 99
in some ways, i know that last image is worse than the first, but in other ways, it's an improvement. with all the new controls i added i now have to tame them a bit.
If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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StevieJ
Designer/Artist

Posts: 11264
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I think the last one is much better because it does away with alot of the blur and makes better use of the plain black areas of the first one.....

Suggestion.....maybe for another filter......taking out the stretch perlin noise.....doing multiple difference blends starting with at least four separate perlin components set at varying size and stretch.....experimenting with just kicking up the details on the predominant component thru the differences.....and setting up levels to compensate for the lightness loss thru differencing. You could also experiment with slapping in other noise components. This alternate noise creation seems like very interesting "undiscovered" territory.....
Steve

"Buzzards gotta eat...same as worms..." - Clint :)
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Kraellin
Kraellin

Posts: 12749
Filters: 99
hmmm, not sure why i'd use a difference blend here. seems backwards to me, not that that invalidates it. i just normally do this type of filter as overlays, like the waterfall one. each aspect/element is on a leg and i simply blend each leg in when and where it's appropriate.

lol...oh, you said 'maybe for another filter'. not this one then? you're thinking down the road already. i'm still trying to figure out this one smile:) yeah, there's a ton of possibilities in 'noise'. i'm using one 'stones' here on this one and about 6 to 8 perlins on the various legs and plugged in at mostly, but not always, normal nodes. i even have a remnant of the snow covered land in here.
If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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ahimsa

Posts: 3163
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Quote
this has to be the most perlins i've ever used in one filter


Have you ever looked at how many kaliedescopes I have used in some of mine? Face it, some of these components want to be used more than once in a filter. smile:D
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Kraellin
Kraellin

Posts: 12749
Filters: 99
hehe, ahimsa, yeah, i know. i did check the filter again and it's only about 4 perlins. just seemed like 8 smile:)
If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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Kraellin
Kraellin

Posts: 12749
Filters: 99
i'm getting there, slowy...

If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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ahimsa

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That would make a nice rock wall area near a waterfall.
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Kraellin
Kraellin

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Filters: 99
hmm, yeah, i can see that.

ok, here's another one.

If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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StevieJ
Designer/Artist

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2nd to last one looking REALLY good!!! smile:)
Steve

"Buzzards gotta eat...same as worms..." - Clint :)
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Kraellin
Kraellin

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thanks, steve smile:)

yeah, first and the one you mentioned are my favorites too. still too much noise in a lot of these.
If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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StevieJ
Designer/Artist

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The noise looks like thresholded stretched perlin.....any way to take it out??? The "wetness" is really starting to come thru nicely on that 2nd to last one....and I agree.....seems like the noise is getting in the way......
Steve

"Buzzards gotta eat...same as worms..." - Clint :)
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Kraellin
Kraellin

Posts: 12749
Filters: 99
yeah, the whitish reflection stuff is through a threshold/set alpha of a perlin. i kinda like that part, though it is a bit rough yet. it's the noise in the 'underwater' part that i think is doing it. i also may have some blending going on at the wrong points. i did find one of those going on. i'll keep playing smile:)
If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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Kraellin
Kraellin

Posts: 12749
Filters: 99
hehe, still dancing all around this one. fix one thing and six more things show up. i've rearranged some lines and deleted a few things and re-mapped some others. still not there, but it's fun trying smile:)

If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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StevieJ
Designer/Artist

Posts: 11264
Filters: 163
My eye now sees a stones, chaffs, and fine logitudinal perlin combo......how did I do??? smile;) smile:)

Maybe you could use the perlin to map cracks on to the stones, eh??? smile:)

It's fun experimenting and coming up with new things.....
Steve

"Buzzards gotta eat...same as worms..." - Clint :)
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Kraellin
Kraellin

Posts: 12749
Filters: 99
well, take a stick and poke yer eye out... no chaffs smile:) but yes, lots of perlins. got to get rid of at least one. that vertical black line stuff has to go... an experiment gone wrong. and yes on the stones. that's the central component here.

and nah, dont think i need to map cracks. i've already got a roughness that beats them up pretty well. though, the roughness is in the perlin, so, yeah.

i dont really like this last version that much. and i'm still not getting what i really wanted with this one. i may have to strip it down even further. i've already taken out the 'sand' that ahimsa wanted. that will have to come later. it's the rock to water aspect that's not right yet. i can make nice rock. i can make nice water, but when i put the two together it kinda sucks. so, i'll get out my hammer and do some more smile:)
If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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ahimsa

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Don't worry about the sand. smile:D
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StevieJ
Designer/Artist

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Quote
Kraellin wrote:
well, take a stick and poke yer eye out

LOL.... smile:D
Quote
Kraellin wrote:
i can make nice rock. i can make nice water, but when i put the two together it kinda sucks.

Getting a little harsh on yourself, eh??? smile;) smile:D

I think it's very interesting to see the results as you "hammer" it out smile;) smile:)
Steve

"Buzzards gotta eat...same as worms..." - Clint :)
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ahimsa

Posts: 3163
Filters: 41
Well your snow and rock filter turned out excellent and you saw the results of how it can be used. The rocks along the water just happened when I applied the texture straight to the terrain. Worked out great. smile:D
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Kraellin
Kraellin

Posts: 12749
Filters: 99
well, i'm putting away the hammer for tonight. gonna go play with the monster for a while. very frustrated with this one at the moment. gonna walk away and come back later.

yes, manon, i really like what you did with it smile:)
If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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