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Kraellin
Kraellin

Posts: 12749
Filters: 99
i've mentioned a number of my wish list items before but i thought i'd put this another way and let others add theirs as well. i dont know if there is time enough for any of these to be done before a release or the next version, but if there is but there is ONLY time for ONE THING to be changed or added, what would yours be?

the one thing that drives me crazy with almost any filter i make is, there arent enough control components do to everything i want to do. and i dont mean enough variety, i mean simply that 10 is way too few! so, that's my ONE THING; NO RESTRICTIONS ON HOW MANY CONTROLS CAN BE USED IN ONE FILTER!! there is no good reason to limit this. let the user apply his own judgement as to how many is too many. so, if only one more change could be made, that's what i'd like.

ok, now i'm serious about this. i've beta tested before and i know there often isnt any time to add anything new or make any serious kinds of alterations. so, limit this to just ONE THING per person. dont do 3 or 4 or you may find that your ONE THING gets left out. if it turns out that most folks all want that one same thing, this sometimes has a chance of making it into the next release...sometimes.

and dont treat this thread like a petition to try and force the developers into something. it's not meant that way at all. if they have time and have the inclination to make that one change, then fine and good. and, if they dont have the time or dont have the inclination, then fine and good also. there is NOTHING guaranteed here or even suggested that there might be a chance to see that ONE THING. this is strictly at the discretion of the developers and meant only as a 'if you can do it, we'd love it' type thing.

craig
If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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uberzev
not lyftzev

Posts: 1890
Filters: 36
I'd also like to see the restrictions removed.

Perhaps filters with more than 10 controls could be constrained to an 'advanced' category so less sophisticated users don't get confused.
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Quasimondo
Quasimondo

Posts: 147
Filters: 32
Since most of the functionalities of the additional components I'd like to see can somehow be assembled even with the current set I also think that the limit on the amount of controls is the most important issue at hand that should be worked on.
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byRo
an Englishman in Brazil

Posts: 138
Filters: 8
ONE THING smile:evil: - Free the Profile Gradient from the restriction to a square!

This rules out a lot of interesting stuff when using non-square images. smile:cry:

I know Vladimir said somewhere that it would mess up the "Seamless" stuff, but for a coder looking from outside smile;) it looks so simple to resolve this problem.

Rô
_________________________________
My favourite question is "Why?".
My second favourite is "Why not?"
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uberzev
not lyftzev

Posts: 1890
Filters: 36
I agree with you byRo. There are ways to work around the control limit but not the forced 'squareness' of everything. smile:evil:
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Vladimir Golovin
Administrator
Posts: 3446
Filters: 55
Quote
uberzev wrote:
but not the forced 'squareness' of everything


Not of "everything" -- for example the Perlin noise is not "squared". This restriction is applicable only to components that can't provide seamless ouput into a non-square region.
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Vladimir Golovin
Administrator
Posts: 3446
Filters: 55
Quote
byRo wrote:
it looks so simple to resolve this problem


Not quite so. There is a lot of subtle internal dependencies that also need to be examined. It's like an ecosystem -- you remove one element and the whole thing breaks apart.
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Vladimir Golovin
Administrator
Posts: 3446
Filters: 55
By the way, great thread -- keep it rolling!
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byRo
an Englishman in Brazil

Posts: 138
Filters: 8
Quote
Vladimir Golovin wrote:
byRo wrote: it looks so simple to resolve this problem

Not quite so. There is a lot of subtle inner dependencies that also need to be examined. Posted: June 1, 2006 6:34 am

I know. That's why my smiley is winking at you. smile:D

Rô
_________________________________
My favourite question is "Why?".
My second favourite is "Why not?"
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uberzev
not lyftzev

Posts: 1890
Filters: 36
Maybe could have a way of voting for which new feature is made a priority?
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Quasimondo
Quasimondo

Posts: 147
Filters: 32
I noticed that the maximum value of the pixel size is always the shorter edge of an image - maybe it would already help if that maximum side would be the longer side - like this there wouldn't be any repetition of the gradient within the visible image area.
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Vladimir Golovin
Administrator
Posts: 3446
Filters: 55
Quote
uberzev wrote:
really reduces the capabilities of the offset filter


The Offset component isn't "squarified" -- it just behaves differently when Seamless Tiling is turned on. This is needed to avoid edge artifacts on effect-type filters. Try turning Seamless on/off in the "Bumpy Glass" effect and you'll see.

Quote
uberzev wrote:
I have some amazing effects in my minds eye that just won't work right now


Could you give us more details?
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Vladimir Golovin
Administrator
Posts: 3446
Filters: 55
Quote
byRo wrote:
ONE THING Angry - Free the Profile Gradient from the restriction to a square!


byRo, I think I have an idea. Can you think of any other specific components to free from "squarification"?
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uberzev
not lyftzev

Posts: 1890
Filters: 36
Sorry Vlad, I had a misunderstanding about the function of the offset filter. Carry on. smile:D
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Ken
CameraKen
Posts: 136
Filters: 16
Vladimir

The Seamless ‘square’ format is only needed for the Texture Filters, and filters created for this category need to be kept seamless, however could this feature not be turned off for all the Effects Filters. What would be the reason for tiling an effect?

Ken.
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byRo
an Englishman in Brazil

Posts: 138
Filters: 8
Quote
Vladimir Golovin wrote:
byRo wrote: ONE THING Angry - Free the Profile Gradient from the restriction to a square!

byRo, I think I have an idea. Can you think of any other specific components to free from "squarification"?


The other basic gradients, 3-colour and 5-colour, also suffer from squarification.
Other than these, I think the rest is immune. smile:D

Rô
_________________________________
My favourite question is "Why?".
My second favourite is "Why not?"
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Vladimir Golovin
Administrator
Posts: 3446
Filters: 55
Quote
uberzev wrote:
Maybe could have a way of voting for which new feature is made a priority?


Such voting would greatly depend on what choices are available for voting, and how these choices are worded. I'd suggest to simply post all ONE-THING-candidates right into this thread -- I believe this will work better because your choice won't be limited to the poll options.
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uberzev
not lyftzev

Posts: 1890
Filters: 36
Ok, my ONE THING vote is for non-square gradients!

Might want to sticky this topic.
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Vladimir Golovin
Administrator
Posts: 3446
Filters: 55
Quote
uberzev wrote:
Might want to sticky this topic.


Done.
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uberzev
not lyftzev

Posts: 1890
Filters: 36
At first I though the 10 control limit was draconian, but after becoming more experienced with the software I've begun to realize that it really isn't a problem 99% of the time. What's nice about it is that it forces you to make more user friendly controls.

The gradient squarification on the other hand is still evil. smile:evil:

You with me Kraellin?
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Lucato
FF addicted

Posts: 505
Filters: 39
And my ONE THING I'd like to see most is My Filters TREE (See attached image). So, in the options I would get to set where My Filters folder is in my HD (Browse...) and I would build the tree as I want to.

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Kraellin
Kraellin

Posts: 12749
Filters: 99
uberzev,

hehe, fraid not. the sqarification issue does seem needed and wanted and is up there on my wish list as well, but without more controls i probably wouldnt make use of it anyways smile;) the controls issue i run into with EVERY filter i work on. the squarification only comes up with a few components, so to me, the controls issue has priority.

as for the user-friendly part of the arguement, i find that having more control over your workflow is MORE user-friendly rather than less. i mean, by that arguement photoshop should be stripped down to only a few functions. yes, it would be easier to use that way, but not really more 'user-friendly' if you dont have the options to do what you want. so, i guess it somewhat depends on what you mean by user-friendly.

there's a very old arguement that still goes on in the computer world. do you 'dumb it down' to reach the common denominator of users or force the user to smarten up by not dumbing down the software. even computer languages have fought this battle. assembly is still my favorite computer language. it's the only true 'smart' language because it's the closest you can get to actual machine language. but it's not the most user-friendly.

FF is very user-friendly and i love it for being so. and it's always going to be a bit of a debate whether you kiss (keep it simple stupid) the software or open it up to more function and expect the user to supply some smarts. i do somewhat like the idea someone supplied of having a 'simple' interface and an 'advanced' one. in the future, the guys making FF may even do whole versions which go one way or the other. buy the simple version for $99.95, the medium for $149.00, and the advanced for $249.00 or whatever.

ok, i'm getting away from the issue a bit smile:) the simplicity of my preference here is that the lack of controls is the thing i run into the most often, but this is because of what i like, perhaps, which is big, multi-function filters that give me a ton of options in creating a new image from an existing one. for others, i do understand that this may not be their preference. and that does put us at odds a bit. hopefully, we'll get both items, more controls and squaification handled. in the meantime, i'll continue to argue for controls and fully expect you to continue to argue for what you want smile:)

craig
If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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Lucato
FF addicted

Posts: 505
Filters: 39
Just updating the image of ONE THING |My Filters TREE:



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bolba
bolba
Posts: 5
It would be really nice to use node instancing. So you can base your networks on simultaneously changing nodes.
Also, as I said in other thread. It would be nice to change scale of the nodes previews (using zooming in/out), to quickly navigate throught your network.
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uberzev
not lyftzev

Posts: 1890
Filters: 36
Ok I want to change my vote, Kraellin you were right after all.

My newest filter uberLENS 2 won't be getting any new features in the future because I've already exauhsted the 10 control limit. I'd really love to add some frosted/cracked glass effects without losing the current controls. smile:cry:
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Kraellin
Kraellin

Posts: 12749
Filters: 99
uber,

just tried your filter. really cool! and i can see why you guys are so keen on the squarification issue. some of those lenses really need to be applied just once and spaced differently for the full range of effect.

and yes, adding more controls on that effect would be incredible.

is there no way to read the length and width of an image and apply effects based on that?

craig
If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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uberzev
not lyftzev

Posts: 1890
Filters: 36
Quote
Kraellin wrote:
is there no way to read the length and width of an image and apply effects based on that?
None that I can find.
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Kraellin
Kraellin

Posts: 12749
Filters: 99
Quote
uberzev wrote:
Kraellin wrote: is there no way to read the length and width of an image and apply effects based on that? None that I can find.


hmmm, too bad. maybe that one shld be added to the wish list also.

craig
If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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Vladimir Golovin
Administrator
Posts: 3446
Filters: 55
Quote
Kraellin wrote:
hmmm, too bad. maybe that one shld be added to the wish list also.


We already have an idea regarding this on our long-term list.
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Quasimondo
Quasimondo

Posts: 147
Filters: 32
Quote
Kraellin wrote:
is there no way to read the length and width of an image and apply effects based on that?


Yes right - image width / image height should work like a control component.
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pixel8ted

Posts: 63
Filters: 65
I vote for the ability to assign scratch disc(s) to another drive. I've crashed a few times already trying to build something too memory intensive. Some sort of resource status bar at the bottom of the application wouldn't be a bad thing either.

Terri
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Vladimir Golovin
Administrator
Posts: 3446
Filters: 55
Quote
pixel8ted wrote:
I vote for the ability to assign scratch disc(s) to another drive.


Terri, this will be available in the next update:

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ProLost
Stu

Posts: 25
Hey all,

My single top feature request, as indicated here, is a version for After Effects 7.0. Basically a plug-in that reads a custom filter file written by the standalone GUI and creates an effect out of it.

This could be a great way to create and share custom effects for AE.

-Stu
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Mike Blackney

Posts: 375
Filters: 57
I think what I'd like to see the most is a text node. Not a comment, node - I mean for creating text. Just creates text (colour from an input) on a background (from another input). Could have size, font, etc. At the moment I've been sending rasterised text to FF from Photoshop, but a node would be a lot more versatile.

(I don't know if this has come up before, but I looked around - funnily enough, a search for 'text' comes up with lots of hits on a board about 'textures' smile;) I really think a text tool would add a heck of a lot to FF.)
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Kraellin
Kraellin

Posts: 12749
Filters: 99
Quote
Mike Blackney wrote:
At the moment I've been sending rasterised text to FF from Photoshop


that's an interesting idea.

and yes, making one's own fonts seems like a natural for FF.

craig
If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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Vladimir Golovin
Administrator
Posts: 3446
Filters: 55
Mike, the Text component is problematic.

First, identical fonts may look differently on different machines, platforms, OS versions, driver versions, video cards etc etc. Plus there's that font substitution thing that makes the problem even worse.

Second, to make sure that downloadable filters work for every FF user (including those who don't have a particular font installed), we will have to embed the font into the filter's XML code, which can bring serious legal problems for us.
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voldemort
voldemort
Posts: 872
Filters: 649
Splines Im sure there is a simple method of doing this that as of yet eludes me but to be able to take a shap (lets say one generated from a profile gradient) and make it follow a spline (with simulated z axis so that all 3 x y and z are represented) and be able to control spacing of said shape or if its extruded.
Also for the external section to add a grab clipboard (this will import whatever is selected at the time and use it as the source image including its alpha

Layers

under patterns righs and circles ( I realize you can use a profile gradient to do this and have done it in some of my filters ) I think this will free up developers for creativity and get them away from having to focus so much on mechanics
lets all whine for a wine port
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Vladimir Golovin
Administrator
Posts: 3446
Filters: 55
Quote
voldemort wrote:
Also for the external section to add a grab clipboard


Interesting. I'm not sure that standard clipboard formats support alpha channels, but the idea is worth exploring. I've added this to our long-term plan.

Quote
voldemort wrote:
Layers


Yes, we have and idea for a "layered blend" component and even implemented the first prototype, but it was really awkward and didn't make it into the beta. We hope to include it in future releases.

Quote
voldemort wrote:
under patterns righs and circles


Not sure what do you mean by righs smile:) (rights? rings?) but the primitives such as circles, rectangles, triangles are already planned (along with components for their placement and distribution, such as bombers/sprayers, grid arrays etc). They won't make it into 1.0 but we'll definitely include them into future releases.
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voldemort
voldemort
Posts: 872
Filters: 649
Glad to heere that and by the way ""rings"" smile:blush:
I did notice that the one topic you didnt touch was splines I realize this really lies more in the realm of 3d apps But comming from a world of using splines in apps like blender I know just how many doors they open up
Hey I never said I wasnt asking for my cake and to eat it to
smile:)
Id like to reiterate again how impressed I am with your product but now that Ive started reviewing posts here its even more impressive your apparent dedication to constant improvement
I hope that you keep your distance from complacency like you have it is what sepperates the good from the truly great
lets all whine for a wine port
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Vladimir Golovin
Administrator
Posts: 3446
Filters: 55
Quote
voldemort wrote:
I did notice that the one topic you didnt touch was splines


Oh yes, the splines. We discussed that internally. Adding splines to Filter Forge is quite a radical change from the architechtural POV -- a Spline is an object that can't be defined parametrically via the component inputs, as everything else in Filter Forge. That means that to add splines we'll need to implement the infrastructure for components that can have their own 'binary' data. This is possible but I wouldn't expect that soon.
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Kraellin
Kraellin

Posts: 12749
Filters: 99
well, having gone through several updates now, my ONE THING has changed. vlad was kind enough to add more controls, for which i'm quite greatful, but now i need to control the controls smile:) aint i a stinker, vlad? smile;) like you said elsewhere, we're never satisfied.

i've posted this suggestion before, but it's now become my number one wishlist item, so i'm posting it again. i do filters with many, many controls. i dont upload them for a number of reasons, but i do use them. most all of these multi-filters use a fair number of switches. and therefore, most all of them branch out into sub-modules or sub-trees. my request is in order to remove the clutter of all these controls, if it's possible, i'd like to either ghost out the controls in the sub-tree when it's not in use or to hide it completely. in other words, if the switch isnt switched to that branch, ghost out or hide the controls in that branch. hiding would actually be better. when you moved the switch to a different position, that new branch's controls would then show up and the old one would ghost or disappear. the BIG advantage to this is that not only do you have fewer controls to view at any given time, but you know exactly what ones are active.

if drop-down menus on controls ever get implemented, this would work also. just put a drop down on the switch control. but i'm guessing from previous discussions this isnt going to happen any time soon, if at all.

the other way would be fly-out panels with menu items on a switch control. but again, i'm guessing that isnt going to happen either.

i've actually found a way to put in a dummy 'spacer' item to divide my controls in the listing. so, i can group my controls into their respective branches with a divider between the groups. that helps, but it can still get a bit confusing, even for me the creator of same. i can only imagine the confusion others might have not knowing what goes with what in the controls (and that's actually one reason i dont upload any of these). it would also help to have a 'dummy' spacer control component though.

anyways, that's my biggest wishlist item currently. and i thank vlad and the FF team for the really great integrity in their testing and the great response to user feedback. it's a pleasure dealing with you guys, even if that may not be true in reverse smile;) (i try not to whine too much smile:) )

Craig
If wishes were horses... there'd be a whole lot of horse crap to clean up!

Craig
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