Competetion

Sounds fun, you'd have to bam a few people like Dilla

As Dilla's "arch nemisis to the properly constructed filter".....I would be compelled to participate.....

so, what's the prize going to be, a copy of genetica 3.xx?

3ds max studio would be nice. i'd even settle for lightwave or illustrator or corel painter

Man if the prize was 3dmax or painter or even ps I would submit like 40 filters. I even saw one company do something like this and the prize was a Wii. If we don't hear from anyone at Filter Forge on this we should do like Crapadilla says and do an un-official competetion, that way Filter Forge may see how profitable it may be. Imagine having the category be something like "workspace" and you make anything realated to a workspace. Or "Holiday", or ... there would be some cool filters that would attract a lot of head turning.

So if anyone at Filter Forge could help us out with the why it may or may not be possible that would be awesome. Thanks

I think any actual prizes are a bit unrealistic. They aren't made of money and those companies don't have anything to benefit from any sort of agreement. Honestly though, people would do amazing things for a little award and a guaranteed editors pick.

If we really want to help move this idea into reality the best thing would be to suggest good contest ideas.

Ideally the contests would have to be something where a lot of the same thing is still useful.
Some of the things I often see requested and think would make good contests:

Bridge Struts: (http://www.artofthestate.co.uk/photos...truts.jpg)

Windows: (http://farm1.static.flickr.com/39/784...8.jpg?v=0)

Railing: (http://www.connectcraftindia.com/imag...oduct.jpg)

The contest could be point based with a number of weighted categories:

Adherence to a theme (realistic, cartoony, 70's, post-apocalyptic, etc., this category could also be used to reward for closely matching an example photo)

Intuitiveness of controls (If I don't know what a slider is, and moving it doesn't really do much- that is a bad thing)

Speed (Overall rendertime, with considerations made for useful "preview modes")

Visual appeal (A subjective category that gauges visual appeal)

Range of Effects (Is the filter limited to a very small number of looks, Example: is the user forced to only have X number of lines/bolts/whatever or can he increase or decrease the number?)

Miscellaneous (A category to reward good filter-making practices- preservation of the size slider, extra creative techniques, not blurring high roughness perlin, non-square images 'if applicable', ensuring proper tiling etc.)


Some notes-

Experienced Judges are a must, voting is unsuitable for something like this.

If a sample picture is used and the filters are designed to match that picture specifically, the PRIMARY preset should NOT feature the picture, it should be representative of the very best that filter has to offer, the First thumbnail SHOULD however try to mimic the image best as possible. (This is to avoid a bunch of clones in the library)

Everything is fair game- if you make the mistake of posting a WIP picture or your filter itself and someone works from that base then you can't complain if someone comes along and does a better job from that base. You also cannot try to pass judgement if someone mimicked techniques used on some of the filters in the library (An example would be copying the grunge technique of a popular wall texture)

Final submissions would have to be through a web portal or via email. This would require some work on the part of the FF guys, but at least we're not asking them to give out multi-hundred dollar software licenses.

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StevieJ wrote: I like the idea of competitions and FF using then to get what they want for the library.....but I'm hoping that FF's effort priorities currently lie with overhauling the code to do away with that #$@%&$#@! resource leak problem, Mac version, and PC V2 to counter Genetica 3.0..... Devil

I agree with you on those points Stevie...

Interested to hear what FF has to say abou this idea.

StevieJ, I believe you; or at least I want to believe you. I just want a free copy of some other software, seeing as I am cheap. I am with Crapadilla though, if FF doesn't sponsor an official competetion I would donate 5 HU to do an un-official competetion. Besides, Crapadilla would probabbly just win anyway and I could keep my 5 HU, assuming he doesn't really want any more.

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StevieJ wrote: but I'm hoping that FF's effort priorities currently lie with overhauling the code to do away with that #$@%&$#@! resource leak problem, Mac version, and PC V2

Yes, your hope is perfectly justified

As for the idea itself, I definitely like the idea. I even considered making contests (with topics given by FF) the only channel of submitting filters into the library. But I can't say anything regarding when we implement this -- we're currently busy working on higher-priority tasks.

Vladimir, would it be okay if a few forum members did an "un-official" competetion with some of our HU points as the prize?

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Redcap wrote: would it be okay if a few forum members did an "un-official" competetion with some of our HU points as the prize?

There shouldn't be any kind of problem.....since their "our" reward points and we can give them away for whatever reason we want.....

How about this.....I'll donate a free copy and lifetime updates (eight HUs totall) if Dilla will match me and put up eight HUs of his own.....then have two "lifetime update" grand prizes.....one for creativity/concept.....and one for technical/construction.....in a contest where participants can submit whatever they want over a three month period.....which would allow everyone to submit to the library for usage while participating in the contest at the same.....

I would also suggest getting CF, Craig (Kreallin), and ssamm as judges.....who would all have to agree on who wins the two grand prizes.....

How does that sound???

That's an amazingly generous offer, a bit too much IMHO, but if you've got them to spare I suppose it doesn't matter a lot for you. I think the "any filter in the next 3 months" is a bit too broad, at the very least you should specify whether it's a texture or photo filter. I think the best idea for something along this line would be a "theme," sci-fi, western, skyscraper or whatever. Then at least there's some coherency and something for the judges to compare between. Moreover, again just my opinion since I won't be contributing anything except likely attempts for the win, I think 3 months is waaay to long. I know you're hoping to get the maximum mileage, but people won't be competetive, will forget, and the contest as a whole will probably fade away.

Just my 2 cents

I agree with Crapadilla. With keeping the competetion short I think 2-3 weeks is more than enough, and 3 HU is more than enough. As far as the category I think we pick something that FF is lacking. For example good sky textures or maybe have two branches, effects and textures with a specific theme. Any way the sooner this gets rolling the more Filters we get

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StevieJ wrote: How about this rationale.....

Mmmm... ... ...no! Well, ok, half a no.

(Why do I keep hearing a dead terrorist shout: "SILENCE! ... ... ... I kill u!" )

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StevieJ wrote: .....A free copy (3 HUs) is a bit lacking for an incentive.....especially for alot of skilled authors who don't need it. A full-boat lifetime upgrade prize might be a little better to get "everyone" involved.....make it a tad more "competitive".....and be better to use for some publicity..... Wink

Personally, I've got all the life-time upgrades I'd ever want, so there is little incentive for me to enter these competitions. The same might be true for other skilled authors that have been around for a while. In my book, these competitions should be aimed at new authors, who would have an incentive to drive themselves to excel and really polish their work. The current editorial process basically allows everything in, but via enforcing certain 'quality' guidelines in the competitions we might be able to raise the bar a little.

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StevieJ wrote: .....Two to three weeks is way too short.....it assumes that no one has a life and nothing better to do than to work on filters for the contest. The longer the contest period, the more filters you will get for it.....considering that many will use the time to submit more than one filter.....which is a good thing. Further, I would suggest that all filters submitted to the library during the contest period be automatically entered into the contest.....that way everyone's filters can be working on usage while being part of the contest..... Wink

Disagreed! To me, keeping it brief appears to be the best solution (we don't want anyone to get bored or even killed by a period of prolonged superhigh anticipation, eh?). Either you have the time to participate (in which case 2 weeks is more than enough for a single filter), or you don't (well, too bad eh?). Also - and that's a personal preference - I'd keep it to one entry per person, and avoid administrative nightmares like all filter submissions automatically being entered into the contest. Rather, participants could 'register' in a special competition announcement thread and would mark their submission with a special note in the filter description (like 'This is my entry for the blahblah-contest...' or something). Submissions could take place at the end of the contest period, so that everything is kept properly 'under wraps' (WIP threads would be allowed, of course).

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StevieJ wrote: .....Too specific of a theme will get alot of authors (especially new ones) to say "why waste my time on it when I'm just going to be blown out of the water by Dilla" Wink A wider spectrum would do a better job of "leveling the playing field" for everyone.....while getting more people involved in it by allowing them to work on something that they would use, like, and enjoy doing..... Wink

I have the feeling that someone is being overrated there!

Regardless, a wider spectrum of themes could be achieved simply by holding many short competitions over a longer period of time. Also, specific themes greatly help the development of certain specific areas of the filter library.

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A free copy (3 HUs) is a bit lacking for an incentive...

no, it's not, not if you're still using the demo. i'd suggest fewer HU's for a 'newbie's contest' and make that separate and then do a 'Pro' version and offer something else.

also, remember, one HU is roughly equivalent to $100.00 U.S., since 3 HU's get you a $300.00 program. so, let's not undervalue those HU's by giving away so many.

also, think long term. i'm going to assume you'll want to do this contest thing more than once. so, giving all your HU's away on the first contest would be kind of silly, no?

and as far as online contests go, the standard length is generally around a month for a contest of this nature. that also makes some sense in terms of how long the demo is good for (without extensions, of course), so, i'd suggest a month long contest.

as for judging, i see three decent options and any of those would work, depending on the type of contest, peer to peer, whoever is giving out the prizes, and by the FF team, or some combination thereof. i'd suggest if you're doing a 'newbie contest' then you let whoever is giving out the prizes, judge, but if a 'pro' contest, then have it either peer to peer like retouchpro does (you vote for the top 5 in order of preference but cant vote for your own), or if FF is willing to adjudicate, then allow them to do it.

and i'd suggest narrowing the field of submissions, at least between 'texture' and 'effect' if not more, but do keep it to the categories that exist within the library.

you also need someone to moderate the event. this wouldnt necessarily exclude that person from entering, but someone needs to 'be in charge' of the whole procedure. it will fall apart without someone doing this, i guarantee.

basically, you need structure here or it wont work. someone has to moderate, there have to be rules, there has to be a time limit and all the various parameters involved need to be known and maintained or the whole thing just goes to hell. so, that's really your first order of business here; who's going to run the show and make sure it all happens like it's supposed to and collects the HU's from whoever and awards them to whomever and liasons with FF if necessary and so on and so forth. that's your first order of business (and i dont want the job ).

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Crapadilla wrote: Rather, participants could 'register' in a special competition announcement thread

as I suggested earlier along with an example of usage apart from the LP as we all know it's not always the best representer

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Kraellin wrote: basically, you need structure here or it wont work. someone has to moderate, there have to be rules, there has to be a time limit and all the various parameters involved need to be known and maintained or the whole thing just goes to hell. so, that's really your first order of business here; who's going to run the show and make sure it all happens like it's supposed to and collects the HU's from whoever and awards them to whomever and liasons with FF if necessary and so on and so forth. that's your first order of business (and i dont want the job ).

Maybe Red would be interested


I agree having set topics would be good idea but with a touch of what steve suggested - as in making them a little more open than just say " Wool " more in say " Organic Natural Fibres " [ example only ]


3 hu's sounds fine for newbies - out of curiosity how many, high numbers of Hu's authors, are going to enter for the incentive of more HU's - Dilla, Craig, Steve ? ?- in other words 3 or 8 has little meaning to us - while 3 to a newbie is great incentive to get the program free

ok that was my 2 cents worth

As a new person to FF the competition idea sounds pretty good. I think even 50% off FF (2 HU) would be a pretty nice prize to win.

Mind I'm currently having fun figuring out the components and how they effect the filter output irregardless of a competition. But a competition would as you say draw more/new people to FF on the chance they might win a prize.

Just an idea though if the entries are from pro FF designers maybe set up a system like the editors choice so their contribution gets downloaded and not lost amongst the others, as a prize incentive for them. Because like you said they probably have no or little use for 3HU's. OR they get a ribbon next to their filter, like Competition winner have two colors one for pro and one for novice, with the month/year next to it. Thats if FF will let you add ribbons to the info or another page for competition winners similar to the editors pick page. Will stop babbling on now

Well lets start the ball rolling...

I could donate :

Adobe Photoshop CS (upgrade)

Cinema 4D 8 **Full Boxed** signed by all the Cinema 4D Development Team

Cinema 4D 9 with Advanced Render & Hair Modules only **Full Boxed**

Hell - I'd just give them all to StevieJ, if he'd just release his 'Alien Metallix' filter...

Seriously though, these are my spares...

Nice texture Redcap!

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Redcap wrote: Tell me... I mean us Wink what you want us to do.

Um.. err.. how many of us are you?
.

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Biomechanic wrote: I could donate : Adobe Photoshop CS (upgrade) Cinema 4D 8 **Full Boxed** signed by all the Cinema 4D Development Team Cinema 4D 9 with Advanced Render & Hair Modules only **Full Boxed**

I would think physical objects might have a slight problem what with postage and packaging v where the possible winners live in the world.

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Biomechanic wrote: Cinema 4D 8 **Full Boxed** signed by all the Cinema 4D Development Team Cinema 4D 9 with Advanced Render & Hair Modules only **Full Boxed**

And what will you be using instead, if I may ask?

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Seriously though, I would do quite a bit for a legit copy of PS.

i'm not going to even say what that statement implies

lol. i can see a whole trading tit for tat thing going on here. very cool i'll trade someone 3 HU's for a legit copy of 3ds Max (lol, i'm driving this off-topic here. maybe we shld start an FF trading center topic or forum ).