Skybase idea of using component result as source for same component

I do not know if the title is right, but I do not know how to explain it the right way.

Skybase has shown in this thread Sharing Noise and specifically in Sharing Noise 003 filter, and more clearly in the filterMondrian by Skybase that you can put for example (it can be used with many components) a tile component, and then the result of it link it with the source of another tile component and the trick is to modify the settings of both so they are mixed, and then again you could if wanted put the result of this second tile into the source of a third tile component and change again the settings.

Here is an example of what I mean with Pavement component, where each one have a slightly different setting.

You can use others components that could work in this way, for example the noise components too.

For this I will use what ThreeDee have shown in this thread Off the Deep End with ThreeDee when he have shared the filter "Blur and Threshold Patterns Snippet.ffxml"

And is to use Threshold to be able to mix this noise components in a better way to get black and white patterns

With the above filter you can´t use an external source for stones as they will be deleted when entering the threshold, so for using images to replace the black or white part you can link the external image to the last threshold component and to the Low or High setting.

Here is shown both results when using Image in either low or high of the threshold

Also instead of having only the main image source, you can add a color control to the unlinked low or high and be able to mix 2 images with the pattern

And also you combine 3 stones (or any other 3 same noise components) with 3 kaleidoscopes after and get even more weird results

Functionally you can do something of this nature by structuring stuff multiple times.

Basically what you're doing with the kaleidoscopes but with loops and some more fancy.

*ahem* excuse me for posting a bajillion times because this is kinda like one of those threads that's going somewhere worthwhile.

Ok, so your first post in this entire thread began with you hooking up multiple pavement components. Yup, so expanding on that same idea, try it with loops. And going back to the Mondrian thing... if you loop the pavement component over 10 times.... you get crazy fractal-like results.

My user gallery thread has several more examples of that kaleidoscope images.

While I am trying and experimenting with Loops I had also the idea to mix similar components, so I have put one pavement, then one tiles and then again another pavement and got a curious result as shown below

I think that also would be good to try Tiles - Pavement - Tiles

Thanks for explaining it and I understand it now, and is think that the best of loops is to use the additional slave components to get more done than just the simple version.

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The Kaleidoscope component is unfortunately quite limited when it comes to use with loops. However, you can always get a bit cleaver by applying various distortions and perhaps even a bit of math. The point being, you kinda need to get around it by constructing your own feature set.

Well, I have found that is great and have a wide potential when using it with loops and you can also put 2 or 3 kaleidoscope components with loops. I could use distorsions but not add any math as I can´t use them in FF.

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Skybase The components that do patterned tilings all behave similarly: bricks, pavements, tiles components. So you can replace tiles from Mondrian with pavements or bricks and get alternative results. I just stuck with tiles because it was the most generic.

Yes, is true, I have seen that they are the same, and what is different is the seed and end result, but behave in same way, and is also the same with all the noise components.

I agree that the Tiles, is the best one from these 3, as is more generic and less packed or fixed result.

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And yup, I used the loop component on it and that's really all there is to it.

Well, I have tried to use Loop with Mondrian filter, but I am getting weird and unusual results, perhaps is because I do not know and can´t figure out how to connect it with the loop component and use the slaves, I mean what components should be inside the loop and which ones outside. I have made 3 experiments without success.

BUT instead of trying to get this lovingly and wonderfully beautiful you have got with loops I have discovered that if I increase the Repeat H and Repeat V in Mondrian filter I can make the tiles and rectangles smaller and is in some similar way an alternative to this you have done

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I limited those because the tiles got too small and became harder to control, especially when designed to use with the next-variant button. Given the nature of how that repeat function works, when the next-variant button is used, there's this bias where you'd get a likely chance of more "medium-to-small" tiles than a fair distribution of "big-medium-small". So that was just a design factor.

Thanks for explaining why this setting was reduced to only 5 values, and I understand well your reason of doing it, and agree with you that when using "next variant" button on my own version, is true that is difficult that it chooses to show big tiles and the random have more chance to medium and smaller ones.

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Skybase And yup, I used the loop component on it and that's really all there is to it.

I have seen again your very well done Loops video tutorial, and have also seen the FF website information about loops and how it works and the limitation it has, because I have seen that there are some things that you can´t do as you can only use the available green links on components and none of the grey or blue.

I know that you used loops on mondrian filter, but the question is how and where did you use it , what components are involved in the loop and what links are connected, because in the Tiles components none of the green links have any relation with size of tiles, it is on grey, and also that ouput links can be many, but input link is only one, and so if you disconnect one to connect the loop to it must have some similar effect, or maybe the trick is to use the groups component because it adds external aditional input links

DISCOVERED THAT YOUR LOOPS TILES CREATION GIVES IRREGULAR DISTRIBUTION

I have told you above

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BUT instead of trying to get this lovingly and wonderfully beautiful you have got with loops I have discovered that if I increase the Repeat H and Repeat V in Mondrian filter I can make the tiles and rectangles smaller and is in some similar way an alternative to this you have done

But now looking at both more closely and more the details, I have seen that they are not at all the same, because all the mondrian filter results give always regular tiling inside horizontal lines, and none of the lines go up or down in the SAME ROW all keep inside the same straight horizontal line, AND when you look at the Loop Tiles they have random and irregular distribution and does not follow any horizontal line.

THE LOOPS VERSION HAVE MORE DIFFERENCE IN SIZES TOO

I have also seen that when looking at the loops version you can see a much wider and bigger difference of tiles sizes than what you can see in the mondrian filter result that are more regular and with less variation.

So know I know why I felt in love with your Loops example and do not love much my own version when modifying the Repeat H and V to 15 value in Mondrian filter, although is good and I like it too, is not at all the same as yours that is much better.

Although I do not know if your Loops version can be used also with included images or only with plain colors.

Mondrian Repat HV Vs. Woop (Mondrian with Loops)

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Skybase Just to make it more entertaining, you got 1 week. Good luck

1 week? I better make it in half an hour! as you can see here below

I have been able to solve it and find the solutions thanks to your well done last explanation that made me go the right way

I mean this

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Skybase Nooo... those two examples are different items. Mondrian uses tiles component, the other one uses pavement with a different setting. The resulting pattern in the end is different and won't line up! I get what you mean, but it's not the same!

OH, I see, I got it wrong and I was trying to use the mondrian filter with tiles and did not work, and was because it was not this way at all, you did NOT use mondrian filter at all

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Quote SpaceRay THE LOOPS VERSION HAVE MORE DIFFERENCE IN SIZES TOO No, looping isn't causing that. What's causing further complexity is simply because the loop component is repeating the same operation multiple times. You can get the same effect by stringing the same component multiple times (for example 10 pavement components with the same seed number = the same result as a loop set at 10 iterations.)

This has got me in the good and right direction and I found what it was wrong

Thanks very much

Here is the filter if anyone want to use it
I think this has a great potential and can be further developed, and will see what can be done

This filter is For FF 4.04

10 Pavements Joined.ffxml

This means my "homework" is still up in the air!

Excellent! Now design something around it instead of just doing that

What is funny and now I laugh at it is that I completely misunderstood it and really was trying to apply the loops to the original and whole mondrian filter, and after trying different things, and some possible alternatives, I could not figure out and find a way to use loops inside your mondrian filter. Well the problem was that was really wrong and was MUCH simpler than all this

By the way, the above loop is from a filter I made with loops from the example given by Vladimir Golovin on Loops page

Iteration count should be limited down from 50 to something less, there's almost no point with that iteration count provided the way jitter's offsetting the internal material. Also, this is one of these "subjective conflicts" I have. The appearance of these really tiny chipped pieces and fragments just look like errors than something designed. Not like I'm against that, the chipping appearance serves less of an appeal.

Here I have made another test and experiment mixing Pavements + Tiles + Pavements and adding Hue range to each one separately, and also using remapping to limit the mortar width.

This is a very simple version with few controls.

I like how this filter can convert a photo into something very complex and very different from the original source

Until now I have used this idea for the following components:
Pavements
Bricks
Tiles
Kaleidoscope
Also works with some (or all ) of noise components

BUT I have just seen that there MORE useful and interesting uses doing the same as I have put in the title of this thread

Idea of using component result as source for same component

I mean that this can be used possibly with many others components and get good and useful results, I wonder:

How many other components can benefit and be worth to try this idea of joining more than one component using the source of the same component?

I know, probably, the answer is, go and try yourself them

USING THIS IDEA WITH DISTORTION - by Uberzev

See this thread --> Make nicer distortions





And as said by uberzev this can be used also for refraction and here below is an example

USING THIS IDEA WITH REFRACTION - by Betis

from this thread first page in the middle The Disquisitions of Betis



I will try and see what more components can be used in this way, please if you know any other component that can have a good result using this idea, would be good to know it, thanks

Very nice topic.
I'm going to use the idea of "10 Pavements Joined.ffxml" for a new filter.

Preset 5 :

Very nice, cool and interesting idea to make it this way, I thanks to SpaceRay, Skybase and Ramlyn for all the comments and ideas. Like it much

Now that these Pavement and tiles have been updated I wonder how different this can be, will have to try and see what happens

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SpaceRay wrote: You can select the source component 1 - Pavements 2 - Bricks 3 - Tiles 4 - Pavements + Bricks 5 - Pavements + Tiles 6 - Bricks + Tiles 7 - Pavements + Bricks + Tiles

I wonder if this idea and technique works only with Pavement, Bricks and tiles or it can be possibly used other components in the same way, maybe I have to try myself if this can be done with other components like Polygon and Ellipses, or with any of the noise components